Epigraph: They desire to extinguish the light of Allah with the breath of their mouths, but Allah will perfect His light, even if the disbelievers hate it. (Al Quran 61:9)
Additional suggested reading: If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of Giants
The Holy Quran has a nuanced position about the Bible. Some of this is word of God and a significant part is word of men. In the New Testament there are 13 letters of Saint Paul and he is not considered to be a prophet by the Muslims.
A simple comparison, how the Christian apologists defended the Bible a few decades ago and now, tells more about the Bible than all their arguments put together.
A lot of what Jimmy Swaggart offered would not be defended by present day Christian apologists, but, the same cannot be said about Deedat’s presentation.
Jimmy Lee Swaggart (born March 15, 1935) is an American Pentecostal pastor, teacher, musician, author, and televangelist. He has preached to crowds around the world through his weekly telecast. According to the official website for Jimmy Swaggart Ministries, his 1980s telecast was transmitted to over 3,000 stations and cable systems each week.[1]
Sexual scandals in the late 1980s and early 1990s led the Assemblies of God to defrock him, and to his temporarily stepping down as the head of Jimmy Swaggart Ministries.[2]
Swaggart makes some tall claims about himself, about him being saved as a proof for the truth of the Bible, around 1 hour 49 minute mark and obviously the claim was falsified by the scandals that followed.
Swaggart’s television ministry, which began in 1975, continues airing nationally and internationally. The weeklyJimmy Swaggart Telecast and A Study in the Word programs are seen nationwide and abroad on 78 channels in 104 countries as well as live over the Internet.[3]
Most or at least very many Christians do not believe the Bible to be literal word of God, any more. The biggest utility of this debate is to record, what the main stream views were about the Bible, just a couple of decades ago.
In this debate Jimmy Swaggart claims that if the text of Bible is corrupted then our faith is in vain. This comment is around 20 minute mark.
Additional Reading
Where is the Injil, is it the Q document or ‘Q?’
Compilation of the Holy Quran into a text
If I have seen further it is by standing on the shoulders of Giants
Categories: Americas, Bible, CHRISTIANITY, Video
The Bible, the word of brings people closer to God and enables them have a relationship with God. That’s the sole significant purpose. When believers are enabled to come closer to God through Jesus His son and inspired by the Holy Spirit then we become co creators with God.
When a misguided pastor burns the Koran we feel sad because that represents something deep and personal.
So the Bible is deep and personal to Christians and requires reflection and scholarly understanding.
Mike, there is certainly a lot positive in the Bible and of course, portions of the Bible are word of God and I often quote the Bible in a positive sense as well.
But, to pretend as if the Bible is all love and compassion is to say that you have not read it.
In this very debate Ahmad Deedat quoted from Jimmy Swaggart’s book on incest that there are ten mentions of incest in the Bible, itself.
Please do not have a case of selective hearing or selective memory, when it comes to the Bible.
Allow me to add just two links here to give the readers a more balanced taste of the totality of the Bible:
Violence in the Bible and Jihad in the Quran
Losing Faith In Faith: From Preacher To Atheist by Dan Barker
See, as Allah intended to reveal the final scripture the Holy Quran, He did not preserve the Bible and the rest is history.
can you tell me the record of Adams sin in the Koran? was Mohammed’s life consistent with his teachings found in the Koran?
First we shall be clear that God is singular.
I am first and I am last, and besides Me there is no God. (Isaiah 44:6) ,
the verse above didnt mention “besides Us there is no God” , its pretty clear God is singular and not in triune.
During the Jew Roman war 66AD, many Jewish scriptures were burnt by Romans. Among them are the early Aramaic-Hebrew scriptures used by Nasoreans (Earliest followers of Jesus) . One interesting fact is that Nasoreans disagreed with Paul, for he introduced a new doctrine that is to abolish Jewish rites and sufficient to only have faith in triune.
Thus, this solidify the fact that Nasoreans never used Greek scriptures upheld by the Romans (as all of them were written after the war where many Jews persecuted and flee from Israel).
Dear Zia Shah
You only quoted one part of the scripture and I think brothe there are other chapters which speaks of trinity specially twice in Genesis please read genesis 1:26 ” let us make man in our image, in our likeness” .It’s plural not singular and further more in Genesis chapter 18:2 Abraham saw three men standing and bowed low to the ground.
And then he said my lord…..further more if you read in mattew 3:16 here the scriptures say as Jesus Came out of water spirit of GOD descending like a dove and a voice from heaven said
…..can you read spirit of GOD came on Jesus and Jesus himself standing on earth and there is voice from heaven
SORRY Wrongly posted in the name of Brother shah….but its for submitter.
My dear, ‘Jesus my lord and my saviour,’ you think that Trinity is mentioned in the Old Testmant.
But, when most articulate of Christian apologists are in presence of Jews, they think that Old Testament does not mention Trinity:
[youtube http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QqfuPGeZQbY&w=470&h=275%5D
Trinity: A Rabbi Versus a Christian Apologist
I have Avery little knowledge on religion,but I see one thing that trinity doctrine is wipe out from the R V S bible as fornication,innovation and coraption.
Dear Jesus my lord and my savior, none of the points mentioned in your July Posts prove anything about Trinity. The old testament denies any other God beside the One GOD. Jesus himself said “You have One God.” Polytheism is not permitted and never preached by any prophet. Please see the whole OT and NT. It is a great sin to ascribe partners with God Almighty. It is surprising how the church has fallen into the trap of multi-Gods belief.
Jesus was a Jew. He lived a pure Jewish life from birth till end. He never uttered anything against the real teachings of the Jewish people. Jesus had no intention to start a new religion!!!!
The seniors of the Jews who had been trapped for their bad activities wanted to trap Jesus. Those elders accused Jesus of some bad beliefs. Jesus did not agree to those accusations. It is surprising that the church is admitting all those accusations!
I don’t know why Christians go in to a debate about God and his word with Muslims who don’t even understand what Qur’an is saying. Muhammad told his followers to seek understanding from Christians and Jews, because the truth is already reviewed to them. Although Muhammad wasn’t a prophet(he’s a self made prophet)added to a little kind of madness,knew that the nonsense he wrote call Qur’an will be useless without the help of and understanding of God’s own people to unveil the truth to his people. Qur’an is a wrong reference of the Bible. Muhammad tried to write a message to his people to prove his prophetic office as he falsely claimed but because of his illiteracy, mess up big time. Muhammad said,Jesus is the word of God (be) and his Spirit, but yet,Muslims don’t know that he(Jesus) God. Muhammad confirmed what was said by John in John 1:1. Bible isn’t the word of God, but it contains the written word of God,because God’s word isn’t paper and pen,God’s word is a person(Jesus). The word “be”according to Muhammad, simply mean that,Muhammad real can’t explain how he can say Jesus wasn’t created but was the creator who became flesh. Qur’an either,isn’t the word of God, but contains some collected word from the written word of God (Bible) that’s why Muhammad said they should ask the people of the book which he borrowed word from. Qur’an contains what Muslim describes as sunnah,but isn’t the word of God as well,but can’t separate it from the Qur’an because it’s useful to them for up bringing. Qur’an is no where close to bible knowledge of truth and spiritual results. In fact,there’s nothing spiritual about Qur’an, so I don’t know why a Christian will debate about it. Somebody wrote senseless and nonsense poems and it’s now attributed to miracle? Too funny! If any Muslim say,bible isn’t the word of God or doesn’t contains the word of God, but quotes to defend their Qur’an which they do believe is the word of God is a fool. Muhammad said,all Muslims should listen (believe) all God’s prophets,to attain salvation. But did he listen to Jesus? No! Jesus say one man one wife,Muhammad said no,one man 4 wives. Jesus said no woman in heaven that we will all be like angels,Muhammad said Allah will reward u with 4 virgins. Muhammad was a womanizer,never repented died a sinner and is waiting to be judged by Jesus whom he never accepted as his Savior. Muslims don’t be like Muhammad who was a killer,be like Jesus who was and is a peace maker very much alive till date. Bible is a living book,Qur’an isn’t and wasn’t at anytime a living book. Everything in Qur’an past tens. Muslims should tell us what isn’t useful in the Bible but is useful to defend their Qur’an.
Defensive War in the Holy Quran in 600 Words